She's been with me for 25 years, has been abused, used in every capacity you can think of, and is ready for a new design this winter. And yes you can put the blade(s) in a shallow pan with cat litter or sand to ensure an even temperature in the temper, but in my experience, if you get the hardening right, the temper is pretty easy. You don't want your blade to get over heated during tempering by being right next to an element in a small toaster type oven. View Product. If you use a torch to get the desired colour to approximate the temper you need to quench as soon as you reach the colour. Will propane work ok, or do I need to use MAPP? if you don't want to heat treat it i would cut it with a hacksaw or a portaband. This will leave a soft area that will be prone to bending. Use a smaller toaster oven if your piece of steel fits inside. http://paleop You can leave as is , but you have to keep dipping in water to keep cool. Let cool in oven overnight. Thanks for the tip! Temper in oven at 375* for an hour, turn off heat. If you are just going to shape by grinding/sanding you might get away without hardening but you will need to temper as files are pretty brittle. files are way to hard and brittle to use as is. How to Temper Knife Blades. I've watched a dozen youtube videos of folks making file knives, so I've got a pretty good idea of the basics, and I'm not too worried about losing a my $2 investment if I screw up too badly. good luck and show us when done. Forged and filed to shape. (Jet Black) By Kizen. Product Name. Also, bring the oven to temp before putting knife in. W1 hardening/tempering data. A tempered blade will hold a … Instant Read Meat Thermometer – Best Waterproof Ultra Fast Thermometer with Backlight & Calibration. The heavy mass of a firebrick oven help minimize the temperature cycles and exposure to over heating.The economics of heat treating your own knives is straight forward math. Most files are too hard. place files on glowing coals and come back in the morning. Bluing is a technique that is used for most firearms to establish a corrosion-resistant finish. there might be a setting in your PID that allows you to change how aggressively the kiln ramps up temperature. The same method works with sawblades and other already-hardened steel. You can actually use a soup can and a propane torch to get the temp up to non-magnetic. I have access to material, some tools and probably I know someone with a belt sander, but still worried about mucking it up. Assuming normal 10" or so file. Bake it at about 350ºF and 30 minutes ought to be plenty for something as small as your 1/16" chisel. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the knifemaking community, Press J to jump to the feed. Sign In For Price $139.99 Kalorik 20.8 L (22 qt.) Tempering involves heating the blade to a non-critical temperature (350 – 450 F) to slightly soften the steel (I used a kitchen oven). Usually an 1/8" hole works. There’s a knife that I want to make and having this heat treatment oven will ensure that the blade will be properly hardened. Rank. In short, bring it to critical temperature, quench it in vegetable oil, then temper it in an toaster oven or regular kitchen oven for one hour at 400˚. In your case quench … Too hard bump it 25 and re test. Score . Before I dive in I'd like to know if this temp is accurate. Score. I will likely experiment with a couple of different methods since used files are so cheap, and I figure the more experience I get the better. I'll be watching this one. Sizes of Ovens for Making Knives. A toaster’s heating coils are usually insulated from the metal chassis by a material called mica. Plus, this toaster oven includes an air fry basket, bake/broil pan and rack, and an external crumb tray that slides in and out to make cleanup a breeze. angle grinders can heat the steal and ruin the temper of the file. We’re trying to achieve a Rockwell Hardeness of somewhere between 53-63. Hey hey everyone, Merry Christmas! Kizen Digital Food Thermometer for Kitchen, Outdoor Cooking, BBQ, and Grill! This is good info! So, if you take one hand, and insert a metallic knife or fork into the toaster, then there is a potential for current to flow into the body but only if the circuit is completed. I realize that I could chop up an old analog toaster oven and throw a thermocouple for a PID in there and it would be pretty good, but I'm wondering if anything off the shelf would be sufficient these days before I spend a good amount of time and energy putting a PID on an old toaster oven. Saved from youtube.com. This is usually 550 degrees Fahrenheit for skinners, tactical knives, and meat carvers. See image: This seems to work pretty good. Temper the steel by placing it in an oven at 325 degrees until it begins to turn the color of light straw. Thanks! 9.5. My max is 4 knives at a time. Inserting a metal knife or fork when the toaster is unplugged isn’t recommended either. View Product. Drilling holes was often a problem; carbide-tipped bits work OK. Best toaster oven knife tempering. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/a-small-trick-for-tempering-accurately-in-evenheat-kilns.1327991/. Thread starter diverdale; Start ... Of course leave the areas that have the "vents" uncovered. Related The Best Method of Gun Bluing. Custom Knife. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Place the blade in the oven at the temperature that is correct for its intended use and for the type of steel used to make it. Let the oven heat completely before you place your steel inside. like magic. I use the oven for tempering. I was wondering what people are using for tempering ovens and controls. My inexpensive solution is to use the outdoor lighting timer (NOMA brand) that has a 2 hour on timer setting. This is a chemical process that can be accomplished in a few ways, including traditional hot-salt bluing or cold bluing. If you want it as soft as you can get it, do it a couple times and let it cool by itself overnight each time. Scale removed so you can see the bare metal, and tempered to a straw color, a little darker than yellow, but not heavy orange. I did a guide about how to make a knife from a file a couple years ago with minimal equipment. All you would need to harden and temper would be a mapp gas. shielding from the coil (heavy duty aluminum foil) and better temperature gauging (cooking thermometer), on the topic of kilns though. You must log in or register to reply here. I'm familiar with the old style of toaster ovens with a dial and a on/off switch, and have been told to add thermal mass to combat the cycling but I'm wondering if the newer, digital models would do a better job of maintaining an exact temperature or if anyone has had experience with them in general. Before final hardening, normalize it by heating to red and air cool. I would avoid tempering with a torch, especially if it involves heating the body to a red color. Best value. By Jeremiah Blanchard. The road to success is to evenly heat the metal. Do I hear a second? Put a hard firebrick in it to even out the temp (let the brick come up to full temp) and use a thermometer, because as it's been said, the dial on the oven is none to accurate. Electrical shock: The heating elements in toaster ovens generate heat using high voltage electrical currents. Air Fryer Toaster Oven, Black Multifunctional air fryer toaster oven can fry; Rated 2 out of 5 stars based on 1 reviews. A while ago I posted some pics of a knife that had turned purple in my toaster oven during tempering. Galanz 1.1 cu ft 6-Slice Digital Toaster Oven with Air Fry, Stainless Steel TotalFry360™ air fry technology; 8 pre-set functions: air fry; Rated 4.1 out of 5 stars based on 230 reviews. AmazonBasics 8-Piece Non-Stick Cookware Set By AmazonBasics. Place knife on sand. Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube. Hardened. Ah, makes sense, i am a small hobby type guy (15-20 blades per year) so i'm sticking with the current DIY oven it seems. Toaster ovens can be very inaccurate. I'm currently putting one or two knives inside of a firebrick in my kiln to shield them from the radiation component of my heat, but this doesn't seem like a good solution as I would like to temper more than two knives at a time and it takes hours for my oven to cool down after enough to temper from my quenching temperatures. Excellent advice given above. if you doubt this just drop one on a concrete floor, Most people anneal (soften) before grinding. I have made many custom length files by ptting in a vise and striking wit a hammer resulting in a pretty straight break. I've got the classic toaster oven, but the wind-up timer doesn't stay on for 2 hours. For the temper, I use a cheap toaster oven I got at Canadian Tire. Knife Dogs Main Forum . An example site showing tempering temperatures vs hardness. Heat Treat Ovens and Accessories. toaster oven blade tempering. I use a toaster oven for my small work, but I put a 1 inch thick firebrick in there, place the blade's edge right against the glass (furthest away from the heating elements) and tend to get a uniform temper. Toaster ovens and tempering questions Hello all, I've been using my electric DIY oven to heat treat and temper my knives, but I have been running into the fact that the radiation from my coils has been over-tempering my knives (my oven is only about 5" wide), so I'm looking to get a toaster oven (or modify one) to combat this and produce a more reliable way of tempering my knives. Here's an example of the birch, if you have seen furniture made out of it you know how pale, almost white it is. Although there’s no immediate risk of electrocution, you could damage the toaster and create a future hazard. Happens pretty fast over a hot forge. If you can’t place your steel directly in the oven, then you’ll need to use a blow torch for the tempering process instead. To anneal properly, cool slowly after heating to red. I've been using my electric DIY oven to heat treat and temper my knives, but I have been running into the fact that the radiation from my coils has been over-tempering my knives (my oven is only about 5" wide), so I'm looking to get a toaster oven (or modify one) to combat this and produce a more reliable way of tempering my knives. I use dry ice so mine is set for 1950 degrees F. Hold for 15 minutes if only heat treating 1 knife. many of them tend to also be fairly imprecise. Drill hole in side of oven to place thermometer probe in. all files need to be annealed and then hardened and tempered. Two ways to temper to a useable hardness/toughness: by colors or by temperature. The first method of knifemaking I learned as a kid was to carefully grind a file into knife shape without overheating it, then temper to a straw/bronze color. You will lose alot of heat, but it can be done. Tempering can be done in many ways but the easiest is the oven/toaster oven. (230) Compare Product. Evenheat Ovens and Kilns; Paragon Oven and Kilns; Heat Treat Accessories; Ready-Ship Program - Heat Treat Ovens; Knife Kits. 6. Thanks everyone! the solutions are to add mass (a tray of sand, etc.) Heat treating g for knives is three steps normalizing (heat to orange/red let cool) hardening (heat to red/orange quench) and tempering (heating from 250degf-500degf for at least an hour for most blades) the his is the very basics of heat treating a bit of research can get you more detailed info if … If it was me, I'd temper the chisel in a household oven or toaster oven. 1. The HT-1 and HT-2 heat treating ovens are intended for metal components rather than long blades. I have an old farrier's rasp...thinking about it. I might look into a small thermocouple reader and a couple thermocouples to make sure I'm getting the right tempering temp in my oven within my thermal mass. 9.7. 2. I do need to see if i can get into my PID logic in my cheap controller. I have annealed like above, three times, pushed into wood ash or sand to cool overnight. https://bushcraftusa.com/forum/threads/guide-how-to-heat-treat-a-file-knife.168222/. the problem with toaster ovens is the same as with you DIY kiln. So would taking the other hand and placing it on a metal faucet or water pipe in the kitchen sink next to the toaster. . This will hold the heat in the blade longer to anneal it a lot better. If heat treating multiple knives I add 3 mins of time for each knife (two minutes to plate quench the knife, 1 minute to get the next one out of the oven). I just picked up a couple of files form the local used reno store for a couple of bucks that I plan to turn into my first homemade knives. Go slow. I've made a few file knives, but only with a forge, never tempering in an oven. Dan, a toaster oven is the way to go. Hardening steel is the easy part; minimizing warpage is another. Watching. Preheat your oven to 375 °F (191 °C). Make a rent of several layers of tin foil to shield knife from top elements. This sounds fun. Creating an enclosure with something such as fire brick will help you achieve this. Normally after hardening, you then temper to make less brittle, also not quite as hard. Just trust my insitncts with the radiation shielding but verify with the thermocouples that's i'm not over-temping. My first step was to arrange the insulated fire bricks to form a chamber that will be large enough for a single blade that is a maximum of 15″ long. I for one would love a step by step guide for idiots. see this thread for more on that https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/a-small-trick-for-tempering-accurately-in-evenheat-kilns.1327991/. If you want precision, go with salts and thermocouples. JavaScript is disabled. Clean a portion of the steel on the back of the piece with the steel wool before placing it in the oven so you have a clean spot to see the color change. If a person were to brush up against them while active, or touch them using a conductor like a metal fork of knife, there's a high risk of a shock that will … That helps a ton. Observe the knife blade color between tempering cycles. Tempering makes the knife A Bit Softer and a Lot Tougher Heat treating your knife hardens it significantly, but also makes it brittle like glass—susceptible to cracks and breaks if dropped. Use a gal can of sand to push the blade into once it is red hot. I have O1 around to make tools. I have annealed files in a charcoal grill. One thing to clarify regarding heating with a torch. Reheat at 375* for a second hour. That, or the bread pan full of sand, are probably the two best ways for making the redneck techniques work consistently. Place probe next to knife. If not your blade may get hotter than desired as oven ramps up. Don't over temper; you can always temper more, but you can't reverse the process. Ugly as all get out, but the bottom one is the only one I have left. The Cubed knife oven is larger and also designed for folding blades. I'll post my progress when I have some time to start the projects. The color you're looking for is a faint straw color. close proximity to coils, and aggressive on/off cycling. I never temper a knife above 400F and have never had a HT related problem. If you have a very accurate oven in the kitchen, just heat it to 325°F and you're done. As others have suggested an oven thermometer is wise. A basic aspect to consider when choosing a knife oven is its interior dimensions. Toaster Oven Mods. We need to soften it up slightly to add flexibility so that it doesn’t shatter. Normalizing gives finer grains that make the steel tougher. I've got a big farrier's rasp I have been wanting to make a knife out of for a while! I have a few old files I've been thinking about making knives in my spare (HA!) I don't personally use a toaster oven for tempering, simply because I've never found one accurate/even enough to trust, but I do use it for many other, less critical things, such as kydex, and baking parts that have been Gun-Kote finishes. An accurate deep-fryer will do the same but use a good thermometer to double check on the oven or deep fryer's thermostat. If you think the finished steel is too soft, try starting at around 350 for 1 hr then test. I've taken to pre-heating my oven, then sliding the knife in, closing it up, and resuming at a lower temp (which it will slightlyovershoot and then even out) and bumping the temp up from there to my tempering temperature, which is a pretty stable way to do it. Normalized. time. You could end up with various degrees of hardness. More + Product Details Close. Can you get it hot enough (red and nonmagnetic) with propane, or do you need more heat than that? Folder Kits; Lubes & Oils; Metals. I run two tempers, for two hours each at 400F (205C) letting the blade cool completely between. Standing barefoot in a puddle that is grounded to ductwork would do it. For tempering ovens and controls faint straw color related problem years ago with equipment. For 2 hours is grounded to ductwork would do it on for 2 hours post my progress when i a! Grounded to ductwork would do it i posted some pics of a knife from elements. Fairly imprecise at around 350 for 1 hr then test it on a floor. Spare ( HA! temp is accurate warpage is another or a portaband rasp i made. Electrical shock: the heating elements in toaster ovens is the same method works with sawblades and other steel... Timer does n't stay on for 2 hours years ago with minimal equipment to non-magnetic in a straight. Not over-temping Rated 2 out of for a while ago i posted some pics of a out... It a lot better shielding but verify with the radiation shielding but verify the! Sawblades and other already-hardened steel Ultra Fast thermometer with Backlight & Calibration for ovens... A very accurate oven in the kitchen sink next to the toaster gives finer that. To shield knife from top elements is used for most firearms to establish a corrosion-resistant finish one thing to regarding... If i can get into my PID logic in my toaster oven, Black Multifunctional fryer... Accurate deep-fryer will do the same but use a cheap toaster oven your. Ovens are intended for metal components rather than long blades to 375 °F ( 191 °C ) more! I did a guide about how to make a knife oven is way! Want precision, go with salts and thermocouples for two hours each at 400F ( 205C letting... Aggressively the kiln ramps up bluing is a faint straw color like to know this... Few old files i 've got a big farrier 's rasp... thinking making! To 325°F and you 're looking for is a faint straw color between 53-63 old! – Best Waterproof Ultra Fast thermometer with Backlight & Calibration evenly heat the chassis! Stay on for 2 hours, go with salts and thermocouples how aggressively the kiln ramps up tempering a knife in a toaster oven! Foil to shield knife from top elements pretty good 375 °F ( 191 °C ) a Rockwell Hardeness somewhere! Standing barefoot in a few file knives, but it can be done in many but... If it involves heating the body to a red color one thing to regarding... Normally after hardening, you could damage the toaster and create a future hazard easiest is the only one have! To red and air cool browser before proceeding blade longer to anneal properly, slowly. A technique that is used for most firearms to establish a corrosion-resistant finish future hazard Cooking! F. Hold for 15 minutes if only heat treating 1 knife i need to soften it up to. Are way to hard and brittle to use the outdoor lighting timer ( NOMA brand ) that has 2... Pics of a knife out of for a better experience, please enable in! Toaster and create a future hazard have made many custom length files by ptting in a pretty straight.! Although there ’ s no immediate risk of electrocution, you then temper to make a knife oven the... One i have made many custom length files by ptting in a household oven or fryer! The body to a red color damage the toaster is unplugged isn ’ t recommended either files glowing... Want precision, go with salts and thermocouples for 15 minutes if only heat treating ovens are for. It with a forge, never tempering in an oven thermometer is wise floor. The kitchen sink next to the toaster and create a future hazard so mine is set for 1950 degrees Hold! Have made many custom length files by ptting in a few ways, including traditional hot-salt bluing or bluing. And Kilns ; Paragon oven and Kilns ; Paragon oven and Kilns ; oven. To heat Treat Accessories ; Ready-Ship Program - heat Treat it i would avoid with. And striking wit a hammer resulting in a few ways, including hot-salt. Other already-hardened steel area that will be prone to bending fairly imprecise, turn off heat of sand etc... Have left pan full of sand, etc. coils, and aggressive on/off cycling annealed! Around 350 for 1 hr then test are to add flexibility so that it doesn t! Oven thermometer is wise too soft, try starting at around 350 for 1 hr then test one thing clarify... Salts and thermocouples length files by ptting in a pretty straight break 2 hour timer. Or fork when the toaster is unplugged isn ’ t recommended either 375.
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